What Actually Happens After You Die — And Why It Matters Right Now

1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,920
Karen, most people who talk about what happens after we die, give you the same answer.

2
00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:07,920
Right?

3
00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:12,080
There's a light, there's peace, there's love, everything's great afterwards.

4
00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:13,080
A tunnel.

5
00:00:13,080 --> 00:00:18,800
With our guest today, says that that is the spiritual equivalent of telling someone that

6
00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:24,640
Europe is great without mentioning that there are 44 countries involved.

7
00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:29,640
She's met the soul's actual journey between death and rebirth with a level of structural

8
00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:34,960
detail that most teachers in the space don't even come close to.

9
00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:39,520
We're talking what the soul moves through, what nourishes it in those states, what defeats

10
00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:45,320
it, and why understanding that journey might be the most useful thing that you can do

11
00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:49,560
while you are still alive to do something about it.

12
00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:54,200
What if how you live right now is literally shaping what happens to you after you die?

13
00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:57,160
Then I better get on it.

14
00:00:57,160 --> 00:01:01,720
This is so much more of this episode of the Skeptic Medivisitions.

15
00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:03,080
My name is Will and I'm Karen.

16
00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:05,680
In unlike Mulder and Scully, both want to believe.

17
00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:07,720
So we've embarked on a journey of discovery.

18
00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,240
We've talked to people deeply entrenched in the spiritual and metaphysical world.

19
00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:14,160
We've thrown ourselves into weird and wonderful experiences.

20
00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:15,840
I even joined a covenant with you.

21
00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:17,920
And, wait, you joined a covenant?

22
00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,160
Yep, all in the interest of finding something.

23
00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:21,160
Anything.

24
00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:23,400
That will prove that there's something beyond this physical.

25
00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:25,400
Three-dimensional world we all live in.

26
00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:30,400
This is the Skeptic Medivisitions.

27
00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:40,280
Hey there, I'm Will.

28
00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:41,280
And I'm Karen.

29
00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:42,640
Welcome back to the Skeptic Medivisitions.

30
00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:45,160
The show where the Wu meets the Wu.

31
00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:46,160
Really though?

32
00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:52,360
Inna Segal has sold over a million copies of her work in 27 languages.

33
00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:58,040
She has spent 20 years mapping the invisible architecture of the human soul and somehow

34
00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:02,400
found the time to write a book telling the rest of the spiritual industry to lift its

35
00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:03,400
game.

36
00:02:03,400 --> 00:02:08,200
Now, she's a best-selling author whose newest book is called Understanding Modern Spirituality

37
00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:13,840
and she's here to confront all of the vagaries that the New Age movement is asking us to accept

38
00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:14,840
offhand.

39
00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:16,800
Will, Segal, welcome to the show.

40
00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:17,800
How are you doing today?

41
00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:18,800
I'm doing well.

42
00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:19,800
Thank you.

43
00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:20,800
How are you?

44
00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:22,280
So, we are great.

45
00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,840
We are so happy to have you on the show.

46
00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:32,680
Now before we go there, before we go to the big question, this entire conversation probably

47
00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:36,520
needs to be framed around how you came to all this knowledge.

48
00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,800
I know you spent a lot of time diving into Eastern and Western traditions, but the thing

49
00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:45,720
that most caught my attention was the angelic being that predicted the events that would

50
00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:49,480
happen in your life with such breathtaking accuracy.

51
00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:51,560
I just think we need to go there first.

52
00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:52,960
I didn't mention that.

53
00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:53,960
I know.

54
00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:54,960
I get the dissurprise.

55
00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:55,960
So...

56
00:02:55,960 --> 00:03:09,400
I guess if we rewind back, I'm going to say that when I was 19, I got pregnant and I was really

57
00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:12,480
conflicted about having a child that young.

58
00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:15,640
It was definitely not in the plan that I had.

59
00:03:15,640 --> 00:03:25,280
I felt like I had to totally change what I thought my life was going to be, which was really moving

60
00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:27,920
to LA and becoming an actor.

61
00:03:27,920 --> 00:03:31,280
And so, it wasn't easy.

62
00:03:31,280 --> 00:03:38,840
I think over eight months pregnant, I went to see a midwife and I really wanted everything

63
00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:44,200
natural because I believed in natural birth and natural ways of being.

64
00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:50,000
And so, I was going to have good birth in this birthing center.

65
00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:57,840
And so, she was saying to everything's fine, but there was this feeling that I just couldn't

66
00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:02,000
explain like something was really, really wrong.

67
00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:07,240
And I said to her, it feels like something's wrong with the baby's heart.

68
00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:12,480
And she said, "No, no, you're just yelling and you don't know what you're talking about

69
00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:14,160
and so on."

70
00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:23,400
And so, maybe a week or two later, I ended up going to labor and I got to the hospital and

71
00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:31,120
I remember getting into a wheelchair because my partner on time, he was parking somewhere.

72
00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:37,000
And I totally different me, do I put her hands on my belly and she said, "When was the

73
00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:39,760
last time you felt the baby move?"

74
00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:45,520
And I just remember thinking, "What a weird, crazy thing to ask me at the time when I'm having

75
00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:46,840
pain and everything."

76
00:04:46,840 --> 00:04:55,720
And so, anyway, we ended up going into the birthing room and it didn't take hugely long, maybe

77
00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:59,040
a few hours and I get birth and then there was silence.

78
00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:03,480
I remember thinking, "What's like, something's really wrong."

79
00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:10,800
And then there was a midwife who actually didn't know and she just said, "Look, I'm sorry."

80
00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:16,400
And it took me while to even figure out what I'm sorry meant, but eventually, obviously,

81
00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:18,520
on the show that the baby died.

82
00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:26,120
And the first thought I had was like, "Oh my God, there is something completely wrong with

83
00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:32,680
me way, way worse than anybody has said because I actually had no idea that it happened

84
00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:39,000
in Australia, especially to somebody who I had just so in 22 days before that.

85
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:44,480
So it was just not a concept that I could really understand.

86
00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:51,280
And I was just staring at the ceiling thinking, "I don't know how this even happens."

87
00:05:51,280 --> 00:05:56,680
And obviously, I need more tests done because really, I'm not well because this isn't helping

88
00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:58,680
to people.

89
00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:06,640
And I know this is not actually the question you asked about the angel, but this was the first

90
00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,560
experience I had of an angel.

91
00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:20,400
And this angel said to me, "It was very feminine in appearance, very white in the kind of like people

92
00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:22,200
do describe."

93
00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:29,200
And she said to me, "It's okay, you will have two children soon and she showed me a boy and

94
00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:31,080
a girl."

95
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:35,520
And after that, I felt peace for maybe three hours.

96
00:06:35,520 --> 00:06:39,840
And I remember going to a bathroom and talking to my partner at the time and saying, "It's

97
00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:43,000
okay, I'm going to use this experience blah, blah, blah."

98
00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:44,000
Things like that.

99
00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:45,000
It didn't last.

100
00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,600
I was going to say that peace.

101
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:52,760
There was three hours where I was just like, "Oh my God, and I call this warmth pouring into

102
00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:54,560
my body."

103
00:06:54,560 --> 00:07:04,000
So if we rewind, sorry, if we go fast forward now, a little bit, I was really, really struggling

104
00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:10,440
with my health within the next few months to point where I could walk.

105
00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:11,840
And that has happened before.

106
00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:15,640
And I was just, I felt like I didn't want to be here.

107
00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:19,280
I just actually really wanted to experience death.

108
00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:24,360
And there was a moment where I went to see a car parked and he basically said, "Look,

109
00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:25,360
your body stuck.

110
00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:28,040
There's nothing I can do for you to go home."

111
00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:35,500
And when I went home, I ended up deciding to do self-healing even though I didn't actually

112
00:07:35,500 --> 00:07:42,440
know exactly what that meant because I don't think you do it 20 anyway.

113
00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:48,720
And so I essentially just tried to connect to my body.

114
00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:50,040
I was breathing.

115
00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,040
I was asking questions.

116
00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:59,800
Al, can I felt a very similar energy of just warmth going through my body, but I could

117
00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:01,280
also see this golden light.

118
00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:03,720
I didn't see an angel or anything.

119
00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:07,840
But then for whatever reason, I asked if I could see into my body.

120
00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:18,400
And there was a whole vision and wisdom and memories that started coming up of all the

121
00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:24,920
things that happened that could have caused my body to break down.

122
00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:30,360
So that was really transformational.

123
00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:40,280
And after this experience, I ended up realizing that I could see into my own body from what happened,

124
00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,680
but I could literally scan it.

125
00:08:43,680 --> 00:08:51,960
But I could also see into other people's bodies and into their energy fields of souls.

126
00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:58,760
And that kind of led to a real journey of...

127
00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:04,360
I think similar to what I heard you talk about in terms of interviewing people.

128
00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:11,120
And I was also studying professional writing and editing and trying to figure out what is

129
00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:16,920
this skill or how do I work with it, how do I help people.

130
00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:23,400
So I did that and I also started seeing people one-on-one for many years.

131
00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:29,600
And that led me to writing my book, the secret language of your body that you mentioned that

132
00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:30,600
soul.

133
00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:38,400
But that question of, I guess, what, is there more had never left to me?

134
00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:49,960
And so I had this really, really strong feeling when I was about 25 that I had to go deeper into

135
00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:51,240
that exploration.

136
00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:59,700
And to do that, I also had to stop interviewing people that I was interviewing because I would

137
00:09:59,700 --> 00:10:03,320
write articles and then I would meet them.

138
00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:06,680
I would go to their workshops.

139
00:10:06,680 --> 00:10:12,520
In some ways, I was going into this journey through meeting a lot of people and learning

140
00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:13,520
from them.

141
00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:22,680
It felt very strongly that I needed some space to allow myself to explore in a different way.

142
00:10:22,680 --> 00:10:24,680
And so there was a moment.

143
00:10:24,680 --> 00:10:26,720
And I remember thinking I was 25.

144
00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:34,200
I was about to turn 25 and I had organized two meet, Louise Hay and Wayne Dyer and interview

145
00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:35,760
them.

146
00:10:35,760 --> 00:10:41,760
And I remember thinking, "Oh my God, I hope that I get to do that before I turn 25 because

147
00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:44,600
I'm literally about to turn 25."

148
00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:50,560
And I met both of them, but I didn't get to interview them because of whatever different

149
00:10:50,560 --> 00:10:51,560
things happened.

150
00:10:51,560 --> 00:10:54,920
But I get, I turned 25 before.

151
00:10:54,920 --> 00:11:00,640
And so that was real sense, "Oh my God, what do I do now?"

152
00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:09,800
And so it kind of comes to that story that you were mentioning, which was, I was kind of

153
00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:12,560
a little bit lost of where to go, what to do.

154
00:11:12,560 --> 00:11:17,040
I mean, yes, I was seeing a lot of clients and doing healing sessions.

155
00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:22,800
And I had started teaching, but I really, I had not written my book yet.

156
00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:25,240
I really know where to go.

157
00:11:25,240 --> 00:11:30,640
I might as well ask, maybe nothing will happen, but maybe something will.

158
00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:37,720
And so I was lying in bed and I asked another angel appeared to me.

159
00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:43,160
And this was, again, we're talking five years in between these appearances.

160
00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:45,160
You know, that is what I was talking about.

161
00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:46,160
Wow.

162
00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:47,160
So you didn't have just one encounter.

163
00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,440
You've had multiple encounters with angelic beings.

164
00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:51,440
Wow.

165
00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,760
So you're hogging it all, not fair.

166
00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:56,760
You got to share the wealth.

167
00:11:56,760 --> 00:12:02,000
You got to share the encounter, please.

168
00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:05,600
So then this was a third angel that appeared to you, yeah?

169
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:11,680
This was the second one where I actually saw.

170
00:12:11,680 --> 00:12:13,440
Oh, got you.

171
00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:18,120
You know, so it probably might have been the tenth for all of you, but you know, in terms

172
00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,120
of visual seeing.

173
00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:21,120
Sure.

174
00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:23,480
Yeah, I see you twisting the knife there.

175
00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:24,480
Thanks.

176
00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:25,480
Yeah, go ahead.

177
00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:26,480
30.

178
00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:30,520
So yeah, I was just lying there.

179
00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:32,680
I kind of thought, I don't know.

180
00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:34,200
Nothing will probably happen.

181
00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:38,360
And because I do have a very strong skeptical side.

182
00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:46,000
So as, you know, as I was waiting for something to happen, yeah, this angel appeared and she

183
00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:57,400
said, well, it's strange that you still don't know what you have for things, but since

184
00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:02,880
you keep asking for clarification, she said, basically, you know, you will be, you will

185
00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:15,680
write a book maybe more than one, but you will be traveling around a lot and you'll be teaching.

186
00:13:15,680 --> 00:13:23,320
And then she said something that made me go, I totally made this up.

187
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:28,800
She said, and because my question was this, okay, well, that's nice.

188
00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:30,840
That sounds like a great fantasy.

189
00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:33,960
But I live in, you know, at that time I was living in Melbourne, Australia.

190
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:39,520
I'm like, I live in, you know, in a place that is the furthest away from the rest of the

191
00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:43,440
world, pretty much in terms of doing things like this that you're describing.

192
00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:45,720
I've never been on a plane by myself.

193
00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,120
I'm terrified of that, actually.

194
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,400
So how is this exactly going to happen?

195
00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:59,880
You know, I'm slightly confused because I remember saying, don't people need to know about

196
00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:03,080
you for this type of thing to happen?

197
00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:07,200
And she said, yeah, don't worry, you'll have publicity soon.

198
00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:10,000
I actually use those words.

199
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:13,920
And I remember thinking, oh my God, I must be really tired.

200
00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:17,040
I'm making all this stuff up again.

201
00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:21,280
And I was like, yeah, angels don't say those sorts of things.

202
00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:24,680
Goodbye.

203
00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:28,560
And then I said to my partner at the time, because I think it was a Saturday.

204
00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:34,840
And I said to him, had this weirdest experience, I think I actually think I made it up.

205
00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:37,240
So I'm just saying this to you.

206
00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:40,600
And I told him, and he said, why are you so skeptical?

207
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:41,600
I believe it.

208
00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:44,600
And I was, I remember thinking, really?

209
00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:45,600
You believe it?

210
00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:46,600
It's so weird.

211
00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:50,840
I mean, who gets an angel tell them they're going to have publicity soon?

212
00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:54,840
It's just weird, because I actually haven't done anything to warrant publicity.

213
00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:55,840
I don't have a book.

214
00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:57,160
I don't have anything.

215
00:14:57,160 --> 00:15:01,920
So that just makes no logical sense to me.

216
00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:06,800
And so the day passed, I forgot about it, to be honest.

217
00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:08,880
And then it was around nine o'clock.

218
00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:11,400
And again, we're talking Saturday night.

219
00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,840
I'm sitting there and the phone in the kitchen and the phone rings.

220
00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:23,520
And I'm thinking, hmm, who would bring me at nine o'clock on a Saturday, probably my

221
00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:24,840
mum and...

222
00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:27,040
Tell her who's the mother.

223
00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:29,360
Yeah, not in the mood for this.

224
00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:32,360
For this conversation.

225
00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:38,480
So I don't pick up the phone and I'm just watching it and it keeps ringing and ringing

226
00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,280
and I'm thinking, why is it not going to the answering machine?

227
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:43,320
It's just really strange.

228
00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:46,240
And then I thought, oh, fine, I'll just pick it up.

229
00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,680
And so I didn't pick it up in a usual nice way where I'd go, hello.

230
00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:55,600
I picked it up and I'm like, oh, oh.

231
00:15:55,600 --> 00:16:00,120
And this woman on the other end, who was not my mum, my...

232
00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:03,440
You guys, oh, oh, oh.

233
00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:04,440
My name's Julie.

234
00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,400
I didn't think that you would pick up the phone.

235
00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:13,960
Hi, I'm a journalist for Women's Day, which I don't know if you guys have that magazine,

236
00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:14,960
but it's like...

237
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:15,960
You should do, yeah.

238
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:19,240
Women's Magazine Australia.

239
00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:25,360
And she says, yeah, I'm a journalist for Women's Day and I heard about you and I would love

240
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:29,960
to interview you and I remember thinking, what?

241
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:38,000
Who have I told that's playing a prank on me because this is ridiculous.

242
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:41,280
And so I said to her, could I get your name, please?

243
00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:47,120
And so I got a name, I wrote it down and I said to her, if I'm going to the milk bar,

244
00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:52,080
get Women's Day and bring it here because I think this is a prank.

245
00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:54,640
I don't think it's a real thing.

246
00:16:54,640 --> 00:17:01,720
So he went to dead this magazine and I'm speaking to her and she goes, so yeah, we're chatting

247
00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,160
and she goes, oh, so I'm in Sydney.

248
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:05,800
I'd like to interview in person.

249
00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:07,800
When are you in Sydney?

250
00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:14,440
I thought this is super strange as well because a couple of weeks ago, I decided to do this

251
00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:22,360
thing where I think I had interviewed Paula Coelho and Paula Coelho had said that he had

252
00:17:22,360 --> 00:17:24,840
done a month of dental.

253
00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,560
So anyway, he brings the magazine and yes, it's her.

254
00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:33,680
It's the woman who interviews people for the spiritual section of the magazine.

255
00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:42,080
And again, we're almost finished chatting and I say to her, okay, you know, get her number.

256
00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:47,040
I'll let you know when I'm in Sydney, which is going to be soon and where we can meet

257
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:48,040
up.

258
00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:54,640
She says, hold on, wait, wait, just before I hang up, I have one last question for you and

259
00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:57,200
I was like, okay.

260
00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:01,480
And she goes, do you work with angels?

261
00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:04,520
I just never thinking.

262
00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:09,120
I could write, like I couldn't write about a novel about this.

263
00:18:09,120 --> 00:18:10,640
Like this is insane.

264
00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:13,520
Well, no one will believe it if they read the novel.

265
00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:14,520
Wow.

266
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,080
This is so crazy.

267
00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:22,960
So yeah, then I met her a few weeks later and she goes, you know, when I was talking to

268
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:27,680
her on the phone, she said, I'm actually quite psychic, but I don't tell many people in

269
00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:28,680
a setter.

270
00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:29,680
Okay, really?

271
00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:35,000
And she goes, can I give you a reading?

272
00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:41,520
And I was like, hey, and she said, well, I just kept hearing this voice in my head and

273
00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:47,200
kept saying TV, TV, TV, you're going to be on TV soon.

274
00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,360
I was like, okay.

275
00:18:49,360 --> 00:18:50,600
All right.

276
00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:56,840
And then she said, and you'll be traveling a lot soon, so you should get prepared for that.

277
00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:04,040
Anyway, two weeks later, I think I was on a TV show and because I went to that particular

278
00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:11,480
town on a holiday, I ended up connecting with someone and said it was my first trip to

279
00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:14,280
Paris where I was teaching a year later.

280
00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:25,440
I think so it was, yeah, it was really kind of crazy in terms of that part because I couldn't

281
00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:28,440
logically figure out.

282
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:29,440
All right.

283
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:31,440
That's incredible though.

284
00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:32,440
Yeah.

285
00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:33,440
Oh my gosh.

286
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:36,440
And I would think that you would know that at that point, you're on the right direction.

287
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:37,440
Right.

288
00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:38,440
Or on the right path.

289
00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:39,440
Yeah.

290
00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:45,400
Which denying at that point, or did you still find a way to second guess it?

291
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:53,360
I think at that point, I went, okay, I'm on the right path and I kind of felt that I went

292
00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:57,680
going, going home, you know, for the next few years.

293
00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:00,720
I, you know, I write my book, The Secret Language of Your Body.

294
00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:05,240
I found a publisher very easily at that time in Australia with us.

295
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:13,960
I started traveling around Australia and Paris mainly.

296
00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:17,480
I think Paris and England and London.

297
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:27,320
And it was when I was 28 that I started having these really strange feelings, which kind of

298
00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:30,600
leads to what you were talking about.

299
00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:38,760
Where I started to feel like, is there more to this?

300
00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:44,920
Because by that stage, I felt like I'd read every kind of new age book that I could find

301
00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:50,720
especially to do with whether it was healing or whether it was what happens in the spiritual

302
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:52,520
worlds.

303
00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:55,800
And, you know, and I had gone, especially in 2020, I don't remember.

304
00:20:55,800 --> 00:21:05,320
I went to see this person who was doing kind of at the type of hypnosis where your mental

305
00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,800
experience going in between lives.

306
00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:14,040
And it just, I don't know, I went home and it just didn't feel good.

307
00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:18,040
And when I say, I paid a fortune for it.

308
00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:25,760
And, you know, and I came home and I was like, I just, I don't know if what I am.

309
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:35,520
I'm reading and if what I'm, if what I've just experienced is, feels right, it just doesn't

310
00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:36,520
feel right.

311
00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,200
It's not like right for me now.

312
00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:45,320
And I remember, it was like, I had a little mini crisis at that time.

313
00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:48,600
And I remember thinking to myself, is there more to this?

314
00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:56,320
Because I feel like there's just this recycling of information that is happening.

315
00:21:56,320 --> 00:22:01,160
And since I was very young, 20, when I started really getting into it and reading, and you

316
00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:09,600
know, I've been in this for eight years or more because I met my first part, like long

317
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:14,920
time partner when I was 18 and he was talking about all of this stuff, but I was just not

318
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,960
quite ready to get into it until my own experience.

319
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:23,640
So I was like, you know, so between eight and 10 years, I've been exploring this and now

320
00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:25,520
just, it's feeling style.

321
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:27,120
I just feel style.

322
00:22:27,120 --> 00:22:37,680
And I feel there was a sense like I had this kind of like this black triangle, like a hat

323
00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:39,840
around my head.

324
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:45,280
And it was like, I couldn't get past it.

325
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:47,480
I couldn't get beyond it into like what else is there?

326
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:52,560
What else is, you know, what am I not understanding at this point?

327
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,200
I was very frustrating.

328
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:59,800
And then over the next few years, I still was traveling a lot.

329
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:06,680
And at that stage, I think when I was about 30 or 31, I started traveling all over the

330
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,760
US and I met a lot of well-known people.

331
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:11,440
I spoke alongside them.

332
00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:17,200
And I remember going, I don't want to be honest with myself, but I'm actually seeing the

333
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,640
same like triangle around them that I'm feeling into myself.

334
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,440
Like they're not going to be part, I'm not going deeper.

335
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:35,360
We're staying on, you know, this surface and this is feeling very uncomfortable.

336
00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:38,680
So you started going deeper.

337
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:39,680
Yes.

338
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:45,160
How did you do that?

339
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:53,920
So I just kept asking, you know, and I was like, show me more than this.

340
00:23:53,920 --> 00:24:01,360
And the first thing that happened, I think, was that I started meeting a lot of people that

341
00:24:01,360 --> 00:24:02,360
weren't famous.

342
00:24:02,360 --> 00:24:09,360
But they were, I felt like they were part of this soul group, you know, that I came from

343
00:24:09,360 --> 00:24:17,760
like, I just would meet them and it just, it felt completely different than just naturally

344
00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,160
meeting someone.

345
00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,880
You know, and they were several.

346
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:28,600
And I was, and I remember thinking, I just, it's like, I can't put my finger on this feeling

347
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:33,280
that I have with these people compared to everyone else.

348
00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:36,320
And it feels like a spiritual experience.

349
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:44,960
It feels like, you know, literally being like someone essentially kind of like unlocking

350
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,640
something inside of you.

351
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:53,280
But I still didn't feel like I was getting quite the information that I was after, but it

352
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:58,400
definitely felt like things were being unlocked and unwound.

353
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:04,160
And then I came across the work of Rudolf Siner.

354
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:10,800
And I had connected to his work earlier from the perspective of, you know, knowing there

355
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:16,840
were Siner schools and going, I'm going to explore this as an option for my children because

356
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,080
I want to see if they can go to an alternative school.

357
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,520
But I really didn't know much more than that.

358
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:33,440
And so I met this German lady in Melbourne where I used to live and we basically got into,

359
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:37,080
I think, a conversation to do with the charkers.

360
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:45,960
And she told me that everything that I thought was true was wrong.

361
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:53,680
And she said it in a very German direct way, then kind of go, oh my God.

362
00:25:53,680 --> 00:26:02,240
And she basically said, look, when you want to learn something real, meaning of her words,

363
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:03,240
get back to me.

364
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:04,240
Wow.

365
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,440
When you want to be a deeper and I really take well to that.

366
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:09,440
I remember.

367
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:13,240
Can't say that I blame you.

368
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:24,400
I felt quite shaken, but at that stage, I was married to someone who was like, look, I would

369
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:31,360
like to read this riddle Siner's book because he and I had this joke where he was like, he

370
00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:37,760
called me something like, oh, energy girl or, you know, like spiritual.

371
00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:39,600
And he was like, I want to read this book.

372
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,200
I'm curious, you know, because we both went to this meeting.

373
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:46,440
And he read the book.

374
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:53,440
I remember I actually went to see my mum for a few days and he read the book and he called

375
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:55,440
me and he's like, oh my God, this is amazing.

376
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,600
You need to read this.

377
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,960
And I remember thinking to myself, you don't read.

378
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:06,080
You read the book and you read it.

379
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:11,000
You're telling me to read it and he's like, everything you've said is starting to make

380
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,800
more sense, but I really think you should read this.

381
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,040
So this is a book called Theosophy from a Rura Siner.

382
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,600
So I went and read it.

383
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:27,280
And I was like, hey, this is a very different outlook.

384
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:28,680
This is stretching me.

385
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,160
Obviously, also a Rura Siner died a hundred years ago.

386
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:36,800
So, you know, the language was heavy and, you know, it wasn't easy.

387
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:45,280
And I was like, I'm curious, I'm interested, but I'm also uncomfortable with this because

388
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:49,040
it's very different to everything else.

389
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:50,560
It is very different, right?

390
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:56,320
How much of the siner do you actually take literally yourself out of curiosity?

391
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:57,320
A lot.

392
00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:06,760
I think it's, yeah, in terms of, I think that what I did and what I thought was, I thought

393
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:15,560
at that time for myself, it was like, prior to this, I was very much about, well, I just get

394
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,840
this information, you know, it's fine.

395
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:26,840
I get it like, and I didn't necessarily have a foundation to check anything, you know,

396
00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:36,240
because I felt like in the new ages, there was no discernment, like everything goes.

397
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:43,160
Because, you know, what I felt and what everyone around me who understood his work said, if

398
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:49,600
you jump into quickly, then it just seems crazy, you know, what are you saying?

399
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:58,080
But if you go little bit by little bit and you're not jumping and you actually start to understand

400
00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:05,160
as well as tuning, because remember, I have had the capacity to tune in what hit me about

401
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:13,560
his work originally was that he said, look, you know, if that ability awakens inside of you,

402
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:22,200
this, you know, clairvoyance, let's call it, which, you know, he said, a lot of people have

403
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:27,480
and it comes, it's like an old clairvoyance.

404
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:33,960
You know, you didn't have to do anything to get it essentially, which is 100% what I got,

405
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:39,240
clairvoyance in terms of telling the future for me, but definitely into seeing the aura and seeing

406
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:43,600
the body, you know, what's the whole thing?

407
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:50,200
But he said, but if you, like, let's say go for 10 to 15 years and you just keep using it

408
00:29:50,200 --> 00:30:01,200
and using it, but you don't start doing proper exercises that essentially refine it and

409
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:08,920
evolve with like a musician would, then what it does, it, he said, it'll turn on you and

410
00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:14,680
you will end up getting headaches becoming really angry, your body will suddenly breaking

411
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:16,520
down.

412
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:23,400
And I remember thinking I'm getting, I'm definitely past the 10 year stage, but I'm getting to that

413
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:30,520
15 year and that's how I'm feeling and every person that I know who in the public eye

414
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:36,000
and not in the public eye who's gone through this is having the same experience.

415
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:37,480
So it was scary.

416
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:43,040
I remember I got quite like shaken by it and I thought, I'm not going to do it from the

417
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:48,800
fear perspective, but I do want to understand what he's saying and doesn't make logical sense.

418
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:54,040
So I'd always come back to this, this make logical sense to me and it really did because

419
00:30:54,040 --> 00:31:01,800
I was like, let me just try it, which again, I had to fight through my own resistance to

420
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:05,280
do the exercises that he's fake about.

421
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:13,400
The more I did them, the more I felt it was like, you know, I was being transformed from

422
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:20,000
within and it was almost like a feeling of like your blood is different.

423
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:31,320
You are being changed on such a deep level that you're going, it's still me, but it's like,

424
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:38,800
I have all these colors that I never had in myself and my soul, but I also feel like my

425
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:39,800
blood's different.

426
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:49,280
You know, so I'm going to assume that it takes, like you said earlier, it takes a little

427
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:57,600
bit of diving into it and sticking with it because he's a very polarizing figure.

428
00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:03,040
He talks about believing that the sun and the moon are actually inhabited by spiritual

429
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:04,360
intelligences, things like that.

430
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:10,960
So things that are very difficult to wrap your mind around, because what I know of you

431
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:16,000
from this short conversation, you don't seem like someone who just offhand believes something

432
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:17,000
like that.

433
00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:23,840
So it's hard for someone like you and I who are skeptical of mindset to be able to see

434
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,240
something like that and go, oh yeah, I get it.

435
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:32,800
So what helped you get over that hump?

436
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:35,560
Yeah.

437
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:43,560
We need to take a quick pause, but we'll be right back right after these messages.

438
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:48,120
It helped you get over that hump.

439
00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:54,960
The year of tuning into him and trying to understand who he was as a person, where I could see

440
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:56,840
he was a scientist.

441
00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:05,560
So he actually, when he was six, he was very clear that he was clairvoyant and had experiences

442
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:12,040
where he could talk to people who had passed over and see them, but he was also a clairvoyant,

443
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:15,240
sorry, scientist.

444
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:24,120
When I was looking at everything that he had created in his life, from like originally,

445
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:32,720
I was looking at medicine and, you know, and I guess healing from that perspective that

446
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:40,000
he, what he taught and what I would do is I look at what he said, because it was again

447
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:45,880
over a hundred years ago and then I'd go, okay, he said this would happen and it wasn't

448
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:49,520
happening at that time, has it happened?

449
00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:57,040
And more often than not, the discoveries that he spoke about were made, I don't know,

450
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,000
in the last 20, 30 years.

451
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:04,000
And I was like, okay, well, that makes sense.

452
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:10,880
And then I would look at, you know, so what he created was something called antroposophy.

453
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:17,880
So I'd look at the medicine and how it was different to the medicine that we have.

454
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:23,480
And I would go and read and, you know, also listen to a lot of his lectures that had been

455
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:28,160
recorded around those topics and I'd be like, oh my god, that makes no sense.

456
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:30,240
Or that's what I've seen.

457
00:34:30,240 --> 00:34:39,320
So I actually really started with the body a lot and then I'd go, hey, what about, I mean,

458
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:43,280
I've always been interested in food and eating healthy.

459
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:49,000
So when I learned about biodynamic farming, which was from, you know, from Urduf Sainar, I was

460
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:56,800
like, let's go and try these food, go to the farms and understand, like, what's the difference?

461
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:03,360
And the first time I really consciously tried the food, I was like, this is not comparable

462
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,880
to organic food that I'm used to.

463
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:09,440
You know, so this is, like, what is this?

464
00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:10,600
What do you guys do?

465
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:15,840
And again, it sounded a bit crazy what they did, but I was like, but it works.

466
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:19,280
It just tastes completely different.

467
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:28,600
So, you know, and then I actually ended up going to Switzerland to where he has, he's kind

468
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:34,840
of something called the Gertianom, he's basis.

469
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:39,040
And he was an architect on top of that.

470
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:48,520
And so I went around the little city where he, you know, he lived for a long time.

471
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:53,800
And I looked at the architect to something I love as well.

472
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:58,080
And I was like, oh my God, how did he do that?

473
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:04,200
And then, you know, I looked at the schooling and the schooling made sense, you know.

474
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:09,160
And then I was like, hey, coming back to your question, where do you get this self about

475
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,000
the moon, the sun, all of this?

476
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:16,560
And, you know, he talks a lot about the Bible.

477
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:24,360
And he essentially, and the gospels, and he breaks them down in a way that I'd never seen,

478
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:28,400
you know, anyone else break it down.

479
00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:35,160
And I would literally meditate on it and I'd go, hold on, because again, nothing that he

480
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:40,000
did is kind of like what we have now.

481
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:46,120
You have to, you have to be your own scientist, you know, like you have to put all the pieces

482
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:47,640
of the puzzles together.

483
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:49,480
It's not given to you.

484
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,920
You have to figure it out.

485
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:53,640
And so, and I like that.

486
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:54,640
I love that.

487
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,880
I love that being a detective.

488
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:01,360
And so I love this detective work.

489
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:06,440
And so, you know, the more I looked into it, the more I was like, oh, but that's what the

490
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:07,440
Bible says.

491
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:10,320
Oh, that's what it means.

492
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:18,200
Okay, this is not as kind of like black and white as maybe I thought.

493
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:26,000
And the more I understood his language, and the more and so what he was saying, the more

494
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:33,480
it kind of inspired me because it felt like not like somebody telling you what it is, but

495
00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:44,480
essentially pulling you into your own detective work and discovery and figuring it out and going,

496
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:50,000
I'm going to sit with this idea and I'm going to allow this to grow inside of me and then

497
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:51,400
I'm going to figure it out.

498
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,400
And then I'm also going to, I think for me, it was slightly different than for a lot of

499
00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:56,400
other people.

500
00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:03,440
You know, I felt like I had, I'm not going to say not complete access because I definitely

501
00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:12,400
you know, haven't, but I've had a lot more access to seeing into people's bodies for, you

502
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:21,320
know, so like over 20 years, you know, and I've had access to, but that's age maybe 15 years,

503
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:29,000
but you know, I've had access to like having, you know, spiritual beings communicate with

504
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:36,880
me and I have been around people where 100% didn't know them and would give them messages

505
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:41,480
and would test my own self, you know, like didn't know anything about this person and then

506
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:48,920
would give a message to them from, you know, someone that passed over, again, wasn't my

507
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:54,120
kind of line of work, but it happened quite a bit at different times.

508
00:38:54,120 --> 00:39:01,120
And so, you know, so I guess that to me was like, I'm not just going to believe everything

509
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:02,120
I read.

510
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:08,400
I'm going to figure it out in terms of how it makes sense to me from everything that I

511
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:09,920
know and feel and see.

512
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:10,920
Yeah.

513
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:15,280
So all the things that we tease at the very beginning of the show about what happens between

514
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:20,320
your death and your birth is that the framework that you use to talk about that.

515
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:23,800
Does that come from Steiners' work?

516
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:32,680
It comes from a combination of many of my own feelings and experiences before I actually

517
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:40,200
started looking at a word of sign and meet his work that made the most sense to me.

518
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:48,000
So to give an example, I really had an incredible relationship with my grandmother and I definitely

519
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:49,440
felt like she was part of my soul group.

520
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:54,200
I just loved and adored her.

521
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:57,800
And even five years before she died, I was having panic attacks around it like how am I going

522
00:39:57,800 --> 00:39:58,800
to leave?

523
00:39:58,800 --> 00:39:59,800
How is this going to happen?

524
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:03,480
Like, everything's going to fall apart, that type of thing.

525
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:07,760
And so I was actually in Paris.

526
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:12,320
And for whatever reason, again, someone said, one of my friends said, hey, do you want to do

527
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,200
this little process?

528
00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:22,480
To do with family constellations and to find out more about your family history.

529
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:25,200
And I was like, hey, let's try it.

530
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:27,320
And so she said, what do you want to do it on?

531
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:29,600
And I was like, I want to do it on the feminine line.

532
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:33,680
I want to see what that is, what comes up.

533
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:41,280
And immediately in that session, the person who was playing my grandmother, she was saying,

534
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:45,600
oh my god, my leg is so sore and I'm not well.

535
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:48,760
And I was like, oh my god, my grandmother's dying.

536
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:52,840
And I was like, this is the time.

537
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:53,840
And it delayed.

538
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:58,200
I saw my mom calls and she said, I've got to tell you something.

539
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,200
I was like, I already know.

540
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:02,440
And she said, oh my god, okay.

541
00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:09,120
And I said to her, I'm, I'll be coming home soon because I was teaching all around.

542
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:16,640
And yeah, I was like, hey, yeah, I'm going to, I'm getting there.

543
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:25,640
So I get home and I really tried to give my grandmother what I felt I could in the six weeks

544
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:28,400
I had left with her.

545
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:34,080
And the day before she was dying, she said, I remember she was sitting there and she was going

546
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:36,160
in and out, in and out.

547
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:43,680
And her soul came to me really clearly and said, hey, I really, really want you to be there

548
00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:45,000
when I'm transitioning.

549
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:47,560
I want you to help me with it.

550
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:50,880
She insid in her words, but it was very clear.

551
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:54,760
And my cousin was there at the time and I said to her, oh, you know, grandmother wants

552
00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:56,400
me to be there.

553
00:41:56,400 --> 00:42:03,160
So then I remember I was kind of guiding her towards the kitchen.

554
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:09,400
And at one point, her and I were speaking or like she's, you know, not speaking properly.

555
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:18,360
But I see her mother and she appears very clearly behind her on the left side.

556
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:21,520
And I go to her, my god, your mom's here.

557
00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:27,760
And then I see her father and I'd never seen her father before I had seen her mother because

558
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:31,720
I have a connection with her, but I'd never seen her father and I was just shocked and I was

559
00:42:31,720 --> 00:42:33,720
like, I'm going to go get father's here.

560
00:42:33,720 --> 00:42:36,720
And they're both standing behind you.

561
00:42:36,720 --> 00:42:39,680
Again, didn't really know too much about it.

562
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:44,920
And then my grandmother said to my mom, one of the last things she said to her was that I

563
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,160
had a dream of this angel.

564
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:49,560
Do you know what that means?

565
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:53,040
Like, like an angel taking me.

566
00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:58,200
And again, coming back to Rurusynos, Rurusynos talks a lot about the fact that we have this

567
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:05,520
angel that comes with us into every lifetime and actually holds the threads of a karma.

568
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:09,000
And is the being who guides us the most?

569
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:14,120
It's like we always go, God are there so that, but it is our angel.

570
00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:23,680
And so to me, that was so clear because my deepest experience as much as I wanted it to

571
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:26,800
be God was with my angel.

572
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:31,560
And also my grandmother, who didn't really know much about spirituality saying, I'm seeing

573
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:37,400
this white angel that's coming to me, you know, literally the last thing the day before

574
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,240
she went into a coma.

575
00:43:40,240 --> 00:43:50,840
So then I get, you know, when she goes into coma, you know, I see her showing up for me

576
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:56,440
like constantly and I'm like, is she there?

577
00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:58,240
What's going on?

578
00:43:58,240 --> 00:44:04,000
So Rurusynos says that when you kind of like when you start to separate, you have something

579
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:11,760
called theetheric body and the astral body, so the soul body and theetheric, the life body.

580
00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:20,040
And so as they start to separate, you have about this three day period where you go through

581
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:26,240
while you're still here, you haven't gone into the spiritual world yet, but you go through

582
00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:35,360
this journey of visiting different people and kind of like going through backwards, always,

583
00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:39,000
you know, your life and all the different things in your life.

584
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:41,000
And it felt, I didn't know any of this.

585
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:45,360
It felt very strongly that that's what my grandmother was doing.

586
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:51,880
And you know, so then, so I could see her different times showing up to me, but he also talks about

587
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:59,640
the fact that we have this cord that is attached to the physical body and that even though

588
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:05,520
I kind of had heard of it, I mean, I walked with energy cords for years and get me wrong.

589
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:07,400
This is a different cord.

590
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:14,320
This is a cord that connects your soul and youretheric body and astral body and kind of your spirit

591
00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:16,160
to your physical.

592
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:17,160
Sure.

593
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:21,920
And that is something I'd never really deeply read about from anyone.

594
00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:27,520
And I remember sitting there and going when I came to the end of the hospital, like,

595
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:34,080
why is it taking so long for it to kind of unwind and dissolve?

596
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:39,360
Like, she's not letting go and it's painful for her and everyone.

597
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:45,360
And whilst this was happening, I could see my grandmother lost everybody in her family

598
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:47,920
when she was 13.

599
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:52,920
Her mother was clairvoyant and actually told her when she was 12 that she was the only one

600
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:55,800
who's going to survive the war.

601
00:45:55,800 --> 00:46:02,320
And her father would come back for a few years, but every, you know, she was one of eight children.

602
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:05,760
So her mother and the eight children would die.

603
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:09,440
And I could see how each one would be coming there.

604
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:16,720
It was very clear to me, like, the whole family was coming towards her and I was like, wow,

605
00:46:16,720 --> 00:46:19,120
you know, your whole family is here.

606
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:24,760
And even though she was in a coma, there was a tear that went like, there was a clarity

607
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:29,040
that she was hearing me, you know, as I was speaking to her, because everyone else was just

608
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:33,880
like in the panic mode and, you know, I was like, quiet, everyone.

609
00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:42,520
Just like get out of the room, quiet, you know, and she was, you know, like, it was almost

610
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:47,760
like I had to reintroduce her to her family.

611
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:54,440
And like, she, I was the only one who she felt safe with during this process come down and

612
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:58,320
she's like, yes, but you promised, you promised, I was like, it's fine, she'll contact it.

613
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,200
Like she'll let me know when it's time.

614
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:07,520
So we go outside, we go downstairs of this huge hospital and I'm talking, I'm trying to

615
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:11,080
talk to my grandmother, Saul and I'm saying to her, why are you still holding on?

616
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:13,120
What is it that you're holding on to?

617
00:47:13,120 --> 00:47:15,000
And she says, I don't know.

618
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:17,520
And I said to her, okay, is it my grandfather?

619
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:22,840
Because my grandfather was still alive, but he started having dementia and she said, yeah,

620
00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:24,000
I think so.

621
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:31,160
And I said to her, look, I really, really don't think that he can see you at this point,

622
00:47:31,160 --> 00:47:33,080
because he will have a heart attack.

623
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:35,080
Like he's already very fragile.

624
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:40,440
He sees you in this state, you know, he's not going to cope with this.

625
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:48,720
And she says to me, okay, then, and she called me in this very sweet way that she would say

626
00:47:48,720 --> 00:47:50,920
my name.

627
00:47:50,920 --> 00:47:53,840
And she said, okay, I'm going to go then.

628
00:47:53,840 --> 00:48:00,800
And I remember saying to my cousin, run, and my brother came out of the, like, lift at

629
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:06,320
that time and the three of us literally ran through the hospital to her room.

630
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:09,880
And when we got there, the nurse was there and she said, oh my God, this is so great, you guys

631
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:10,880
are here.

632
00:48:10,880 --> 00:48:12,680
She's about to take her last three breaths.

633
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:16,560
I don't know how they know this, but she said, wow.

634
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:22,080
And so we're, we're standing there and we're all like, I'm like, send love, you know, to

635
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:28,960
her and, you know, say beautiful things, like so her soul's like fully out.

636
00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:32,920
Interestingly, again, Rudolf Sainas says that the, the third body is what holds your physical

637
00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:35,520
body together.

638
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:40,520
And it was incredible to see the moment, and I could see how the third left again, didn't

639
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:42,880
know anything about Rudolf Sainas at that time.

640
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:50,200
And he's where the moment the third fully left her physical body lost its shape immediately.

641
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:55,920
It was like, in moments, she went from having a shape to like, you know, like it was a

642
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,840
bag, like the physical body was this bag and I was like, oh my God, wow, okay.

643
00:48:59,840 --> 00:49:02,360
This is really interesting.

644
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:09,480
And then for the next again, few days, she was so present that we had a funeral for her

645
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:11,560
very quickly.

646
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:18,160
And she, my mom, when we're going to the funeral, my mom was wearing this earring and my

647
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:21,240
mom has never in her life lost an earring.

648
00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:28,720
And she said to me, oh, I'm really, I'm feeling, you know, like my mom, my grandmother.

649
00:49:28,720 --> 00:49:30,600
And she said, it's like she's touching me.

650
00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:32,240
She's connecting with me.

651
00:49:32,240 --> 00:49:34,320
And then she lost that earring.

652
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:37,320
And she was like, it's like someone took the earring out.

653
00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:39,720
And she couldn't hide it out.

654
00:49:39,720 --> 00:49:43,560
And she was like, it really felt like this.

655
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:51,200
And so, you know, and then I just started to kind of observe my grandmother.

656
00:49:51,200 --> 00:49:56,800
And my grandmother's journey to the degree that I was capable of in the spiritual world.

657
00:49:56,800 --> 00:50:02,680
And as much as I was so, so traumatized when I had the baby that died and I just, you know,

658
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:04,520
I was like, it was horrendous.

659
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:05,520
I wanted to die.

660
00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:07,320
I wanted to go into the spiritual world.

661
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:11,440
And then my grandmother, it was completely different.

662
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:17,200
You know, it felt like everything that I then, years later, I read about in Reuters

663
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:23,200
Reuners book, like he talks about the fact that the soul communicates around seven years

664
00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:24,200
with you.

665
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:31,880
If it goes into the right area, which is, you know, where the angelic beings are, which

666
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:33,880
is kind of the moon sphere.

667
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:34,880
Right.

668
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:41,400
That, yeah, at a point where, you know, I was trying to understand, yeah, what was going

669
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:42,400
on.

670
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:50,640
So, yeah, Reuters Reuners talk about this seven-year period usually where the soul's able to communicate

671
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:53,400
with you if they go through the right channels.

672
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:59,920
And then they kind of lose that conscious capacity in that same communication.

673
00:50:59,920 --> 00:51:05,600
And it becomes much more as a gesture, communication rather than the words.

674
00:51:05,600 --> 00:51:12,360
And I felt that 100% with my grandmother, like she was constantly coming to me and, you

675
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:13,480
know, we were communicating.

676
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:14,840
And then that's seven-year period.

677
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:19,120
It just stopped being like that type of communication.

678
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:22,120
And I was like, "Oh, okay.

679
00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:23,120
What is this like me?

680
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:24,120
Learn about this.

681
00:51:24,120 --> 00:51:26,360
You know, why is this happening?"

682
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:33,840
And then there was just a lot of things that he said in terms of, you know, going through

683
00:51:33,840 --> 00:51:42,320
the journey of the in-between lives that prior to that, just sounded like a great

684
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:43,320
fairytale.

685
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:55,040
Whereas, you know, I had, again, in my own experience, I met people who had suicideed.

686
00:51:55,040 --> 00:52:00,840
So when I say met, I met parents of the people who had.

687
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:09,120
And I would, again, have these experiences with those souls.

688
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:15,640
And it was definitely not anything that I'd, at that point, read about that made any sense.

689
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:23,960
Because it actually felt like they were definitely not a piece and they were really, really struggling.

690
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:29,520
And so I would give those parents all these things to do, you know, that I didn't know, that

691
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:34,800
then I would read in RuedoSigners' book that you would, this is what to do if somebody,

692
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:36,760
you know, like, suicide, for instance.

693
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:45,200
And that they did not go into the, you know, spiritual realm that, you know, people go naturally

694
00:52:45,200 --> 00:52:48,080
if they don't take their own lives.

695
00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:56,240
So it was, you know, and then I kind of later, later, ended up reading books from people who,

696
00:52:56,240 --> 00:53:01,040
again, studied RuedoSigners' work and had people in their lives that went through it.

697
00:53:01,040 --> 00:53:05,000
And it was almost identical thoughts and experiences that I'd had.

698
00:53:05,000 --> 00:53:13,600
So there was a lot of that going on, you know, and I guess trying to understand astrology

699
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:18,520
from that perspective because I was like, well, hold on a sec, how does astrology actually

700
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:19,520
work?

701
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:26,560
Because if everything's dead, the way that we're told, how do we know about astrology?

702
00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:33,120
Because astrology, to me, feels very alive and constantly changing.

703
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:36,080
And so, how does that happen?

704
00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:45,400
And so this whole idea of everything being alive and spiritual started to make more and

705
00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:47,840
more and more sense.

706
00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:55,200
The more I asked the questions and kind of went, well, none of this makes sense unless there

707
00:53:55,200 --> 00:54:02,040
are higher spiritual beings that are guiding this.

708
00:54:02,040 --> 00:54:11,960
So there are some people that sometimes you wish the show was two or three hours long.

709
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:13,200
You happen to be one of them.

710
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:22,560
I have four pages of notes that I didn't even look at because if someone wanted to learn

711
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:29,000
more about your thought process and what happens and buy your book and things like that, what's

712
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:33,200
the best way for someone to reach out to you?

713
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:46,400
So the best way is to connect with me through going to my website, which is in our seagull.com

714
00:54:46,400 --> 00:54:52,480
in the website, which is constantly getting upgraded.

715
00:54:52,480 --> 00:55:03,480
There is a page for master classes and I really recommend for people to explore the topics

716
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:05,400
that are available there.

717
00:55:05,400 --> 00:55:13,880
And there's also like mini courses where they don't cost a lot, but they take you on a journey

718
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:19,480
of starting to get to know yourself from different perspectives.

719
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:25,840
And yeah, kind of explore that and then if you really want to go deeper and further and

720
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:32,960
just connect, there's definitely a way to connect to my team and we can guide you towards

721
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:40,200
the workshop or the way forward in terms of what you want to learn and understand.

722
00:55:40,200 --> 00:55:41,200
Great.

723
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:45,920
And these courses and workshops and things like that are they aligned with the Steiner

724
00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:51,400
framework or you kind of just have cobbled your own, taking the best parts of everything

725
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:55,080
and made it your own.

726
00:55:55,080 --> 00:56:02,600
It's a combination I'm going to say because I think that if somebody is a staunch root of

727
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:08,800
signer, kind of like this is everything else to be a root of signer type, then yeah,

728
00:56:08,800 --> 00:56:17,080
I would probably find things that are different because I really, I'm going to say this, I

729
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:27,560
had an experience with Brutor signer's wife where she came to me several times and she

730
00:56:27,560 --> 00:56:37,720
said to me, look, your journey is to use your own work and your capacity meets what

731
00:56:37,720 --> 00:56:39,680
Brutor signer has done.

732
00:56:39,680 --> 00:56:46,200
So it's not going to be a complete like rehash of a signer because I think that it's there

733
00:56:46,200 --> 00:56:53,200
and there are lots of incredible people teaching that and she's saying it's like we need something

734
00:56:53,200 --> 00:57:01,400
that kind of combines that work and to your point, he died a hundred years ago.

735
00:57:01,400 --> 00:57:08,400
So his work was of the time now we need to maybe bring it more to the current world by

736
00:57:08,400 --> 00:57:10,400
understanding it.

737
00:57:10,400 --> 00:57:11,400
Yeah, making it fit.

738
00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:12,400
Today.

739
00:57:12,400 --> 00:57:15,560
Better to modest spirituality.

740
00:57:15,560 --> 00:57:21,280
You are a bright, bright soul and we are incredibly honored to have hosted you today

741
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:26,920
on the show and we are hopeful that we will stay in contact because you're amazing.

742
00:57:26,920 --> 00:57:28,120
Thank you so much for being on the show.

743
00:57:28,120 --> 00:57:35,120
[Music]